There are many reasons
that a baby could die
and be considered a neonatal death.
They could be born
with something seriously wrong
and live for a very few days.
They could die within an hour
of being born.
They may be large babies
that aren't babies
that go to a neonatal unit
but have got something seriously
and they die
or they might be a baby
that goes home and dies
of some condition
that wasn't necessarily known about
when they left the hospital.
They die at home.
If it's within the 28 day after
that is considered a neonatal death.
It was like I'd been picked up
and plonked on a different planet.
I was taken into this unit
that had ten incubators in in total.
Machines bleeping, wires everywhere,
I've never seen
anything like it in my life.
It's a very frightening environment,
a neonatal environment,
particularly the intensive area.
There are loads of clicking machines
and whirring and bleeping
and you never know if it's your baby
or someone else's baby.
If any baby's monitor goes off,
it sets out a real fear for the parents
that, "It was my mine this
but it could be next time."
After I'd been there for about ten
Kristina had come off the ventilator
so she was breathing for herself.
She just had the CPAP monitor.
They said, "Would you like to hold her?"
wouldn't stop me holding her.
It was the one and only time
that they took her out of the incubator
and they laid her across me
and we sat there
for probably two and a half hours
until she needed to go back in.
They said the same. "Would you
to hold Lucy?" I said I'd love to.
But when it actually came to it,
they said, "She's not well
today. Maybe tomorrow."
But it never happened.
That's what's quite hard knowing
that I've held one and not the other.
It never occurred to me that they'd
both die. It wasn't going to happen.
So I think, in a way, when Lucy
it was the worst thing ever.
I think one of the things
that really is important
to recognise around neonatal death
is that for parents there's an
joy of actually having a baby,
even if it's born early
or with something wrong,
there's this pride in actually
had a baby and the joy of that.
Then there's the enormous despair
when that baby has something very
with it or that baby dies.
The complex swing of emotions
is very, very great.
I really did beat myself up over it
for a long time,
the fact that I had strong feelings
Lucy but not so much for Kristina.
But then, as time went on,
actually it switched.
I started to distance myself from Lucy.
When I thought there could be a
that she might die,
and Kristina was going to survive,
suddenly it all changed.
Bonding with them, I suppose,
depending on who needed you the most.
was a lot more drawn out.
- It went on all throughout the day.
- Yes, it did.
(Leigh) I remember sitting
in the waiting room
and it was probably
the longest hour of our lives.
Eventually, they came down and said,
"We've done the operation,
but we can't save her."
Parents love their baby
every bit as much when it's died
as they do when it lives,
so we need to give ultimate respect
for how we approach families
around a postmortem.
We decided against it.
When they were alive, they were
and prodded and poked so much
that we just thought now they've gone,
it's not fair on them
getting pulled about any more.
So we decided it's not fair on them,
so we weren't going to do it.
Although there's all these medical
as to why they died,
purely and simply, they died because
they were born too early. We know that.
It doesn't really matter,
the official term.
They died because
they were born too soon.
Men and women
often grieve very differently.
However, how they're treated
by their family, the hospital staff,
the people involved,
has a big impact on how they manage
the rest of their mourning.
It's not helpful to give Dad
all the jobs to do
and Mum all the loving support.
Dads need loving support.
Mums might need to be given
some of the tasks that there are to do
around a baby that's not well
and then eventually dies.
Talking to people
that have been through the same
is the only thing that helped me.
Other people will try and understand
but unless you've actually been
it yourself, then you don't know.
I never thought I'd be the kind of
person that would walk into a group
and say, "Hello, my name's
and I've lost my twins."
I'll talk to people,
even if people don't want to listen.
Sometimes you need to talk.
Just force it on people.
They may feel a little bit uncomfortable
but at least you get to say
what you've got to say
and it's off your chest for that day.
In fact, it's the best thing
I could have done.
I surrounded myself with people
who completely understood
everything that we've been through,
had the same emotions,
the same feelings,
I remember thinking,
"This is normal, then."
I've got these silly little memories
that we have got...
..that make us smile, and we've
got that that we can look back on.
(Leigh) The more than time goes on,
you do just learn to cope with it
a little bit better.
You still have good days,
you still have bad days.
You can be walking along,
minding your own business
and someone walks past with
a twin push with two little girls in it,
and then that's it
for the rest of the day.
But as time goes on,
it does get easier to live with.